Author Topic: Removing the sticks? WTF?  (Read 1530 times)

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Offline malibu casey

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Removing the sticks? WTF?
« on: May 18, 2012, 06:12:43 AM »
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  • Not sure how I missed this but "the dangerous wood jetties in the surfing area on Beach 90 Street will be removed after the beach season ends."  Lets see- a major project at the main surfing beach in..... September?  Whose idea was this?

    http://www.rockawave.com/news/2012-05-18/Community/Beach_Boardwalk_FixUps_On_Track_For_Summer.html

    Beach, Boardwalk Fix-Up's On Track For Summer

    Parks Working At Six ‘Priority Locations’
    By Howard Schwach

    Damage from the storm to the area between the boardwalk and Shore Front Parkway will also be repaired.With $3.8 million to spend, thanks to grants from Queens Borough President Helen Marshall and City Councilman Eric Ulrich, the city’s Department of Parks is working hard at six priority locations on the boardwalk to get its facilities up and running in time for the summer season.

    A Wave reporter walked the boards with John Natoli, the agency’s chief engineer and chief of construction projects, Queens Parks Commissioner Dorothy Lewandowski and Rockaway manager Jill Weber last week to see the work that has been completed and the continuing work of the agency.

    According to Lewandowski, Marshall’s grant totaled $1.1 million and Ulrich’s $500,000. The rest will be funded by the city, she said, with a reimbursement from FEMA requested when the project is completed.
    While the project is on track, the officials think that some work will have to be completed after the beach season begins at the end of this month because of supply problems.

    “We removed all the damage done by Hurricane Irene,” Natoli said, “but we’re waiting for the decking to be delivered, something that might take another three or four weeks. As soon as we get the supplies, we’ll finish up,” he said.
    He added that all the decking and planks come from American wood rather than from South America as in the past, and that has created something of a problem.

    “The American wood is not as hard,” he said. “We need to use three planks of American wood to replace one plank of foreign wood,” he added.

    The priority boardwalk repairs are being completed on Beach 91 Street, Beach 95 Street, Beach 101 Street, Beach 102 Street, Beach 107 Street and Beach 108 Street.

    Contrary to past policy that called for entire sections to be repaired, this year, to save money, Parks is doing repairs piecemeal.

    The agency is working as well on the parks and handball courts that adjoin the boardwalk and that were wiped out by Hurricane Irene last summer.

    Weber explained that the $3.8 million worth of work is in addition to the normal work that is done each year to get the beach ready for the season.

    The piles of sand on the west end, she said, would be moved to fill in the area in front of the damaged boardwalk and facing along Shore Front Parkway.

    Aside from the work being done, she added, the dangerous wood jetties in the surfing area on Beach 90 Street will be removed after the beach season ends.
    « Last Edit: May 18, 2012, 06:31:52 AM by SeaCliff, Reason: Repaired formatting »
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    Offline SeaCliff

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    Re: Removing the sticks? WTF?
    « Reply #1 on: May 18, 2012, 06:34:31 AM »
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  • Wow - that's crazy. I wonder how long they think it will take?  A day? A week? A month? During hurricane season? Awful timing. Assuming it will take a week or so, they would be FAR better doing it in June - the beginning of our relative flat season.
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    Offline Northstreet

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    Re: Removing the sticks? WTF?
    « Reply #2 on: May 18, 2012, 06:37:13 AM »
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  • WTF?  I'll see what I can find out!

    Offline Smiley's people

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    Re: Removing the sticks? WTF?
    « Reply #3 on: May 18, 2012, 07:41:56 AM »
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  • Wow, if they are going to remove them wholesale I would imagine it would take a decent size crane and a company experienced in marine demolition.  Seems pretty expensive and
    would shut the beach down for quite a while. It is rock though so for all I know they will put some city worker in a wetsuit and give him a chainsaw and send him out at low tide...
    ‘closed mouth don’t catch any foot.’

    Offline Dorado

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    Re: Removing the sticks? WTF?
    « Reply #4 on: May 18, 2012, 07:43:49 AM »
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  • Wow, if they are going to remove them wholesale I would imagine it would take a decent size crane and a company experienced in marine demolition.  Seems pretty expensive and
    would shut the beach down for quite a while. It is rock though so for all I know they will put some city worker in a wetsuit and give him a chainsaw and send him out at low tide...

    Where do I put in my bid  ?
    I resemble that comment

    Offline RayG

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    Re: Removing the sticks? WTF?
    « Reply #5 on: May 18, 2012, 09:09:14 AM »
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  • Except- if they take out those jetties, they will need to replenish the increased scour caused. Those jetties hold sand from being stripped and taken down towards the 100's. How many sets of jetties are they going to pull? If it's only one the scour will be significant. If it's 2 or more, scour will be ridiculous. Within a season or 2 at most, water will be under the boardwalk if it is not replenished often. That's the reason they were put in place in the first place. Maybe I should get a protest group going...


    "SAVE THE KOOK STRAINERS!"
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    Offline Bacon

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    Removing the sticks? WTF?
    « Reply #6 on: May 18, 2012, 11:08:37 AM »
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  • I love the sticks. I wish the would build them up more, above the high water mark.
    I need the sea because it teaches me.

    Offline seb

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    Re: Removing the sticks? WTF?
    « Reply #7 on: May 18, 2012, 12:47:28 PM »
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  • I think a proper study needs to be made here...this could have a negative effect for many...not just surfers...or someone is just making a new hole to sink tax money into...
    it's 6AM, have you seen a donkey?

    Offline Shacky

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    Re: Removing the sticks? WTF?
    « Reply #8 on: May 18, 2012, 12:54:14 PM »
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  • I'll believe it when I see it. 
    You can't stop the waves, but you can learn to surf.

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    Offline Bacon

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    Removing the sticks? WTF?
    « Reply #9 on: May 18, 2012, 01:55:27 PM »
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  • I will conduct a study.

    First we must close off this portion of the beach to all but me and my small team of study companions.

    Second, we will carefully explore the naturally changing bottom contours on each swell.

    Third, we will remove the first set of sticks and my study companions and I will continue to closely explore the bottom contours resulting from each swell for a period of several years.

    At that point we should be able to determine the net gain or loss caused by the removal of the first set of sticks. If the removal was positive, we can remove the second set, followed by several more years of closed studies. If it is negative, we can replace the first set and keep the area closed for studies.

    I'm ready to begin immediately.
    I need the sea because it teaches me.

    Offline Northstreet

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    Re: Removing the sticks? WTF?
    « Reply #10 on: May 18, 2012, 02:05:28 PM »
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  • After two people have died on the sticks, I'm of the opinion that the safety issue outweights any potential impact to the waves.  I'm sure the sticks do a little something for the secondary break, but they might also limit the potential to get a really really long left off the rocks. BUT, until I hear something a little more fact based than The Wave, I'm with Shacky....

    Offline SeaCliff

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    Re: Removing the sticks? WTF?
    « Reply #11 on: May 18, 2012, 02:09:30 PM »
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  • After two people have died on the sticks, I'm of the opinion that the safety issue outweights any potential impact to the waves.


    I'm with you. People have died, and just about every one of us, myself included, have had our run ins, including one close friend just a couple of days ago. I understand the potential effect on the long left and even the righthander that develops (possibly) because of those sticks, I don't care. My friends are more valuable to me than a couple extra seconds on the face of a wave.

    My issue is not that they're removing them, it's the timing. September is probably the most consistent we have as far as waves go, and therefore will be the most difficult for the workers and the work itself.
    « Last Edit: May 18, 2012, 02:12:53 PM by SeaCliff »
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    Offline Northstreet

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    Re: Removing the sticks? WTF?
    « Reply #12 on: May 18, 2012, 02:17:38 PM »
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  • Early Febuary sounds good to me....

    Offline Bacon

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    Removing the sticks? WTF?
    « Reply #13 on: May 18, 2012, 02:47:50 PM »
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  • Did you hear the joke about the city planner who was genius?
    I need the sea because it teaches me.

    Offline three_fins_out

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    Removing the sticks? WTF?
    « Reply #14 on: May 18, 2012, 03:01:58 PM »
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  • Very interesting. While they do produce a good little wave at time they are way beyond a hazard due to the fact they they are mostly submerged as opposed to the jetty which you can clearly see.

    This brings up an important point though that I think it often missed in most capital projects, whether the construction of a jetty or a building - what is the plan for removal and restoration at the end of its life cycle?

    Most projects have no plan and certainly have no budget allotted to this part of the building cycle leaving them as hazards and the next project to pick up the tab when change or restoration is needed. In my estimation this is a major fault of the CIP system.

    Let's take roads for example. Who pays the cost of removing the road when a repave is unway? The current project. What happens when budget get cut, projects are deferred and some never get done. The whole system is built on future O+M and once that goes down assets deteriorate to the point of being unusable. Is this sustainable?

    Same argument for bulidngs and their end of life

    When we get full cost life cycle accounting for projects the we might actually make some progress on sustainability issues. Until then we are just putting a bunch of crap out there that will eventually become garbage at best and life threatening hazard at worst.

    - end rant -
    can you here me now...good